All right. Uh, welcome everybody. Uh, thanks for joining us for another episode of Checking In. Uh, a podcast about the psychology of money. Uh, we're here just to talk about the good feelings, the bad emotions, all of that fun stuff when it comes to finances, and just our our personal experience with it. Uh we are lucky to be joined today with some phenomenal community leaders. Uh we have Dr. Susanna Ober from Denton ISD and Dr. Lori Rap from Lewisville ISD, both superintendent. So thank you both. We certainly appreciate your time and and everything you do for the community, including things like this. So happy to to spend a couple minutes uh getting to know you guys. So thanks thanks for getting here. Of course. Um as we typically do, we go through a couple different segments. uh first segment being income and I just titled it that uh to to connotate kind of the positive feelings we have with money some of those those good times we have um there's going to be negative times but let's talk let's start with the good stuff first so um I always like to start with the the big question do you remember your first paycheck start Dr. Ober um I I'm trying to think I remember my first job I remember uh having the opportunity to earn money At the time, I uh had just turned 16 and needed gas in my car, I'm sure. So, yeah, I was able to teach gymnastics uh in Lewisville. Actually, I used to drive to Louisville. I can't believe my parents let me do that. Uh to work and yeah, I remember earning money. I don't remember how much it was. And I'm sure it was just to take care of my personal needs. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. How about you, Dr. App? You know, I grew up in a really small town in Texas and we had a familyowned grocery store in a little tiny town called Buffalo Gap. That was my first job. I distinctly remember that first paycheck. Now, it sounds so outdated to receive a written check signed by uh the grandmother of the family who owned the store at the time. I don't remember how much it was or what I got paid. I remember trying to understand what all the taxes were that were coming out of the check. Yeah. A little sticker shock a little bit. Yeah. Because I too was was working just to try to, you know, put gas in the car and just take care of some fun things. But yeah, how did it feel? I mean, when that when that money hit the account, I mean, it's the first time you've had that experience, you know, where you earned money. How'd that make you feel?

That was a long time ago. I know. I know. It was exciting. I mean, there's an independence feel to it. I remember that. Just feeling like I I can do this. And probably like all other 16 year olds, I had uh I thought I had more independence with that small check than I probably really did. Uh but certainly a feeling of I can take care of myself. I probably said something like that, too, that was inaccurate to my parents. it got you on that path. I remember feeling proud, you know, as a distinct emotion probably too. It's funny now to think about I had to take the check physically to the bank to deposit it, whereas now, of course, it's so very different. So, I hadn't really reflected on just how much has changed. Yeah. Yeah. But it was a really long time ago. I remember uh minimum wage at the time I'm gonna say was three and a quarter 350 and they were going to pay me like $5 an hour or something. And I remember thinking I've got the best part-time job of anyone. And $5 an hour I don't think my my own children would appreciate that right now. Perspective has definitely changed. Uh yeah. Well, it's been funny because in a couple of these episodes we've been talking about how some of us were paid under the table. So, we didn't necessarily have the paycheck. you know, it was either a family business or um just you're a little too young to be on the books. Uh so you you got some money outside of that. Uh for me, it was definitely worked at a restaurant. I was uh you know, busing tables, you know, things like that. And um I remember the manager every couple weeks would come by with an envelope. I'd run to the ATM after that and deposit it. Or I should say my parents would take me to the ATM and deposit it. Yeah. Our kids will never experience that, right? No doubt. They don't need to deposit money. It's just direct deposit all wired to where it needs to go. So, Oh, that's funny. Um, so along the lines of that, do you remember what you spent it on? Like, was there a big thing that you were like, you mentioned kind of personal expenses, gas, stuff like that, but was there ever anything like I really want this, so I'm going to work a couple extra hours and and get this whatever it is? I remember saving for gifts for people. like I enjoyed buying a gift for a friend or a boyfriend or something. So, I can remember um you know, socking that money away and just saving for something big for someone else. And I've always loved shoes. So, I'm certain at the time I was probably doing some of that, too. It was probably tennis shoes at the time, but yeah. Yeah. Something personal. So, you're you're a giver. A saver and a giver. Okay. That's it's a good habit to be in. Yeah. How about you? How about you, Dr. You remember? I am trying to think. It probably had something to do with a car and gas. Really? Yeah. And I really wanted a very impractical car when I was in high school. So, and living out in the country, you would spend a lot of money on gas. Yeah. Just getting around. I remember my mom saying, "If you want that impractical car, you're gonna have to try to figure out how to help pay for that." cutting gas, of course. And so that's really what sticks out to me. Yeah. Well, now you've piqued my interest. What's an impractical car? It was a Camaro. Oh, nice. Used. Nice. Pre-owned now, as they would say, right? Pre-owned. We didn't have that word back in the pre pre-loved. Yeah. Yes. Um, and yes, it was very impractical. Of all the cars that I would have pegged you for, a Camaro is not one of them. So, what would you have pegged me for? you. I'm curious. You have a Camaro, too? No, I had an RX7. Oh, okay. But to be fair, my father owned the Mazda dealership, so I had a demo and all my friends thought, you know, that we had way too much money because I could drive a RX7 and it was really just a demo. Yeah. Oh, that's awesome. But yeah, it's good to have connections. It's good to know people. It was. It was. Yeah. That's awesome. Had to learn to drive a stick, but it was a skill that was important and still fun. Yeah. Well, I I was as soon as you said gymnastics in Louisville, I started like like who did I know that did gymnastics? Where was gymnastics? Because I I grew up in in Flower Mountain, Louisville. Now the courtyard K9 or the K9 courtyard, whatever it is. That was the gym. That's where Louisville gymnastics was. Off 407. Yeah. Okay. Cross from maybe Canes or Freddy's. Yeah. Yeah. It's right next door to Canes. Yeah, I know exactly where that's at. Yeah. My first job was Well, not my first. Uh my second job was at a car wash on 407 just down the road. And I thought I was big time because my car was always clean, you know, because there was free car washes. So, um, so that's a lot of fun. Well, as you kind of developed that income, as you developed those budgeting skills, do you remember like what maybe was the thing that taught you the most about money? Was it family? Was it a show? Was it books? You know, how did you guys learn to kind of develop that sense of I've got a limited income and I've got things I want to buy. Here's how I need to balance all that stuff. Do you remember? Without a doubt, it was my father. You did? No question. Now, he was a business owner. I said that, but uh without a a doubt, he was who taught me about money and savings. And um up until not too many years ago, I was still very diligent about balancing a checkbook to the penny. Um it was just a a practice, you know, the paper statement came, we opened it, we had a whole system and Yeah. So at the time I wouldn't consider those good experiences. Um but now my father's passed away now and I think back about those times as really great memories. Were they just stressful or were they just like trying to keep It was stressful because we were going to get it right. I mean it was going to balance. Gotcha. And um maybe that's carried over to my profession now. We're going to balance. Um but yeah, I think it was stressful. Yeah. at the time just because it had to be perfect and you know inevitably I had written something down wrong or you know reversed my numbers and I'm definitely a quick and you know QuickBooks kid uh so my dad was in you know uh it and data and all that stuff so we used QuickBooks religiously and I can remember coming home with the receipts and immediately putting it in you know booking it all that and then when you could start doing it digitally without needing receipts that was just lifechanging right you download all your expenses rather than manually input them. So it was big change and I would say in large part the statement is outdated now you know I mean I receive digital statements of course but I don't know that I really go and review it because I have such constant access. Yeah. Everything's real time so you don't necessarily need to balance uh you know maybe once a month or once a quarter or something like that. Yeah. Yeah. It's a totally different world. Uh we've talked about in in in other episodes just how our kids are experiencing money is totally different now, right? My kids do chores and ask for their allowance, but they're not expecting cash or check or whatever. They're like just transfer it to my account, you know? They never actually see it. So that's that's pretty fun. But Dr. Changed a lot. Yeah, absolutely. How about you? Do you remember the the growing up days and and how you learned about money? I mean, primarily probably from my mom and my stepdad. Yeah. You know, after I got that first job and them talking to me about what to do with that paycheck, how to use it, you know, writing checks, how to log that in your check register. You know, for us as a family, tithing was also important conversation uh with with our money. But my husband would find this conversation so funny because he thinks I'm terrible at balancing a checkbook, budgeting. Um, he he knows what you do for a living, right? Okay. All right. And uh, but he has a very prescriptive way that he likes it. Spreadsheets, receipts, right? So, it's what I'm sitting here thinking is everybody's so different in how they handle money and keep track of it and one person's good practices are not enough good practices for another person. Mine were not good enough for him even though, you know, I helped steward a $570 million budget with the school district. You have skills for every day and, you know, had had math degrees. And so, that's just I'm just sitting here reflecting on how funny this conversation is. But, yeah. Yeah. Well, it's it's one thing we've discovered too in other conversations is the balance that our partners and spouses, you know, bring. Uh, you know, for me, it's uh I'm I'm kind of an immediate gratification guy. So, I'm like, if it's 0% financing, yeah, do it. And, you know, and my wife was like, "No, we got to have the cash for that. We're not financing that." And so, we we balance each other out really well. It sounds like there's some balance there, right? For sure. I mean, and I was happy to turn it all over to him and say, "Yes, go for it. All the things." And you know, now here we are 26 years married and it's still working. Still working. Yeah. And he still does all that. But it does make you think about how money can create such interesting conversations, you know, with your significant other, with your kids, whoever it may be, because everybody just approaches it all very differently. and having kids, it is very different to walk them through the financial tools that are available to them versus Absolutely. I hadn't really spent a whole lot of time thinking about that, but yeah. Yeah, it's totally different world. Um I know when my kids were younger, we tried to do the give, save, live kind of buckets. Um and it just it just didn't take because again, they don't have cash to put in the physical, you know, envelopes, buckets, whatever system you have. So it was it was a little bit harder to drive home the fact that yeah, you've got a a little bit of money over here, but not all of it goes to the same thing. You got to categorize it and organize it a certain way. So how are you guys approaching your kids with it? Well, you know, I as you were talking about uh the difference with children now, I was thinking one of the things we were very intentional about with our boys is investing. Um, so I remember their dad, um, when the oldest had his first job, of course he worked for him at at Joey's, but he required them to put a certain amount, um, in a an investment account, and that wasn't a conversation for me at 16. Yeah, I think the times were different. I don't think my parents were were thinking about money in the future in the same way um, as we do now. And of course he my dad was self-employed and so he was had he didn't have a 401k or you know some of those traditional ways or a TRS system some of the ways that we have to save for retirement. So he changed the way they think about investing and now they're 22 and 24 and both have a really good head start on that um for their future which is not an experience that I had. Yeah. Yeah, I know. You can't replace time, right? Right. So, early investing is is super smart. So, yeah, getting your kids involved. I think we learned that later in life, you know. Yeah. Late 30s. Um the value is he became a independent, you know, business owner. We really started talking differently about that. And so, yeah, they definitely have a better investment in their retirement starting at 16 than we did. Yeah. Yeah. I had a personal experience, too. when my kids were born, I was like, "Okay, I'm going to start now for their college fund, right?" And so, um, I think I I opened like a u not an annuity, but a u insurance policy basically uh to where I would pay on it for 15 years and then I'd stop and it would start paying back and then I could use that for college. But by the time my daughter was four or five, I was like, I can't keep up with this. Like, I've got other expenses that I need to be paying for. And and so I dropped it and then didn't pick it back up until just a few years ago. And I'm like, man, I'm kicking myself if I would have just kept going. Uh, it was a 15-year term and my daughter turns 15 next year, so I would have been done next year and now I'm I'm trying to catch up uh with it. So, so yeah, super smart to get those kids started early. And it's part of my oldest who is he works at he's an architect and it's just a part of his DNA now. Yeah. He thinks about it. Yeah. He just I mean it automatically goes from his paycheck to that investment and he doesn't consider it part of his income if you will that that he can use flexibly. Yeah. How about you, Dr. Wy do anything different with your kids than than how you were taught? I mean I think our kids are more aware of how much money they have and what they're spending it on because of the technology available to them. I can't that to me is I can't think of anything majorly different other than just being sure you use your tools. Yeah. Available to you. You know, you have a lot more tools than we did. Um it's almost made it a little easier to talk about money because it's so easy to view what you have, what you spent, keep track of what you spent. Yeah. So that has been nice. Yeah, I don't think they have a real awareness of the dangers of credit card usage. Um, I don't know if it's how visible it is to them. I don't know. But, uh, both of my kids are have a really wise perspective. My son bought his first truck about a year ago and his plan is to have it completely paid off by next summer and I'm like, that's amazing. Yeah. But he doesn't want to accumulate any form of debt. Yeah. So, I just I'm proud of that perspective that they have. But I'm curious now if it's because it is more visible. Yeah. Just the awareness of it. You can see it on a day-to-day basis. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. We have a family dog, but my excuse me, we have a family dog, but my daughter wanted another puppy. Uh our dog is 70 75 pounds and she's like, "That's not a lap dog. I want a lap dog." And and so I was like, "Uh, you know how expensive dogs are?" A and B, u if you want it, you're paying for it. And it's just she she researched and researched and researched and I just kept putting little obstacles in front of her of like, well, we're not going to get that breed because it's, you know, this expensive and it sheds and blah blah blah. And so finally one day she came, she's like, here's the dog I want, Dad. And I'm like, dang it. She's she's done all the work. And so I finally just said, I'll tell you what, I'll pay for half of it if you pay for the other half. Knowing full well she'll never get there. Well, within six months, she's like, here you go. Here's here's the cash. Let's go get the dog. Uh, but I was pretty proud of her because she there was one that was like brown and it was like three times as expensive as uh the one that we ended up getting that was a black fur coat and I thought she'll she'll want the brown. She'll keep working to save up that money. And she was like, you know, I've really thought about it, Dad, and I think this is a better use of my money to go ahead and get the the black. I was like, dang it. So, now we have two dogs. Lucky you. Yeah. Yeah. Lucky my wife. uh she she gets to take care of all of them even though my daughter said she would take care of it. Um that hasn't quite happened. U love you Abby if you're watching this. U so anyway that's that's actually um pretty decent segment into kind of our expense kind of side the the negative uh feelings if you want to call them that. They're not they're stressful maybe uh maybe that's a better term. Um what are the things that are like you can answer this from a personal or from a business perspective. What are the things you just don't want to spend money on? What are those things that you're like, "Oh, this is a necessary evil. I've got to do this, but it just hurts." You know, what what type of expenses that that show up? How does that show up? I would say personally and professionally, anything that is a repair, right? like I I uh anything that's a you know I think from the professional world this chiller's out or you know something that's a big major expense and I can't help but think of what that's taking away from you know what we could be using those dollars for and I'd say that's probably the same in personal life is um I try really hard to like my car keep it maintained and take care of things so that you don't have those big unexpected expenses, but that's no fun. Yeah, it's no fun to spend money on things that you have to spend money on like that. Yeah. But thanks to your solid planning and your good budgeting, you've got some contingencies and margin to be like, "All right, fine. We got we got that new air conditioner, but glad we didn't have to finance it, you know, etc." Yeah. Yeah. What about you, Dr. R? I would say I think repairs, too. Specifically for me personally, it's always been like tires for my car. You need them. They're important. You never just feel really, you know, inspired after you've spent money on tires, but you're always thankful that you can and that you've spent practically so that you have a car you can pay for the tires for, right? Because that's something I think people don't think about is they think about buying a car and then they don't think about, can I afford the maintenance? Can I afford tires? Things like that. Professionally, I so agree. The things you think about are things that take away from opportunities for kids. P, you know, personally on a professional statement, the bill we write to the appraisal district to DAD is always frustrating to me. That's $4 million and that's not going to experiences for kids. Yeah. and uh we pay recapture back to the state of Texas. That's not what the purpose of this talk is about, but it does make you feel like the Louiswisville ISD is basically turning over tax dollars twice. Yeah, we're paying for the appraisal district. We're one of the largest payments and you know, Denton's probably not too far off of that, too. And then we're also sending the recapture dollars back. So when you work with providing for students in our community, you want the dollars to go to kids. Sure. You know, and I I find that really interesting. You know, I had a career in education as well, so I I follow it fairly closely, especially with kids and uh schools right now, but there are some common misperceptions or misconceptions about school finance just in general, right? Um just a 30,000 foot level. Could you explain? You guys only really have two buckets, right, for for money and you can only spend on certain things out of those buckets. Can you explain that just a little bit? Ah, we will do our best. I say all the time um trust in our community is the best u that we can do to help people understand how we spend our dollars because the system is so complex. Yes. Uh we of course went out for a a Vader voter approved tax ratification election last fall. And fortunately, our community supported that, but we hit the pavement a hundred times trying to explain our two buckets because inevitably the community misunderstands. Um the message was always if you didn't have those nice new facilities, you wouldn't have a deficit or you could pay your teachers more. No, our interest in syncing our INS portion um of our budget is to pay for those things and by law we can't use those dollars to pay for maintenance and operation our other bucket. And one of the other misconceptions I think is um our tier one funding from our M side that tax rate is set by the state. That's not I mean technically our our board ratifies it, approves it, but it we don't have the flexibility in our tier one tax rate to establish that and I don't think people understand that. And what we know and and experience ourselves and I'm sure you do your property tax payment continues to go up. Your ISD is likely your largest portion of that. So, it seems inconceivable that as an a homeowner, I'm paying more, yet as a school system, you're at a deficit. And just the mechanism that makes that work. And we always say, um, you may be paying more, but we're not receiving more. Yeah. And that's inconceivable, I think, to the general population. And rightfully so. To be honest, I'd be confused if it wasn't what I I worked in every day. Yeah, very complex. Oh, go ahead. Well, it just it is very complex which makes it really hard to have conversations around it. You know, as a taxpayer, you see one tax rate, you see $1 amount, but that tax rate is really divided into two portions for us. Part of the tax rate going towards one bucket, which is really your capital outlay, your home improvements, like that would be analogous, right? and your other part of the tax rate is salaries and daily cost and it's it's very confusing to taxpayers. But when the formula that the state uses hasn't really accounted for inflation, yeah, then you're paying more, especially in Denton County because the property values are going up. So, their bills are going up, but the formula doesn't say we need that money here in Denton County to operate, which is then where recapture comes in and it gets sent back. And so, you have certain counties in Texas that are more impacted than others. And, you know, our local schools don't benefit from really property value increases. Yeah, absolutely. There's um a lot of great resources resources out there to to understand this process, but I the one that I found is um raise your hand, Texas. Yes. Um great video. Yeah. Really good organization that breaks down the complexities of it. Um yeah, we don't Well, this isn't a 4-hour podcast, so we can't really break down the nuts and bolts of it, but it is from both sides of it. So, I understand it a little bit more than I think probably the average um homeowner, but when I look at my property taxes, I just shake my head because I'm like, I know my school district isn't getting this, right? And that's what's so frustrating to me is it it goes through so many filters and so many hands that yeah while you guys are experiencing more expenses, you're getting less income. So just just doesn't seem all that all that fair. But um I won't go too far into my personal feelings about it. Uh we'll we'll keep the conversation moving though. Um but staying on kind of the expense side, how difficult is it for you guys to be super prudent with that and just knowing that you're responsible for other people's money? How do you decide between that broken air conditioner and that, you know, program that's going to increase reading levels? You know, how how do you balance those things? What priorities do you put in place? Well, I think um and I'm certain this is the case for Lewisville. It's the case of most of our Texas school districts, 80% of our maintenance and operation budget goes to people. So, we are a people organization. the salaries, the amount of people it takes to educate our children and serve our community is 80% of our budget. And so, um, controlling that as we've had to face, as as Dr. Rap shared, our formula didn't adjust for inflation. So, our utility costs skyrocketed, gas skyrocketed for transportation. You know, everything that we all the supplies, all our contracts, all those costs went up. and the the one mechanism we have to control that because we can't control what's happening in you know the economy of our society right now the only thing we could control is how many people we were paying and so um at Denton ISD we reduced about 250 positions um which is very very difficult to do because the group that is the largest for us are teachers over 50% of of our 5,000 people are teachers. So to truly impact or have a a reduction of cost for our system, it's reducing teachers and in the end of the day, we're here to serve children and the teachers are the way we do that. So um that's why this has been a very emotional conversation because it's a reduction of people to control cost. We negotiate with our vendors. We eliminate all the contracts we can. We've had conversations with DAD, with um Denton Municipal Electric, with everyone that we can have a relationship with to try to control cost, but the end of the day, they're having to navigate this the same economy. And so, we've we've had to do a lot of hard conversations about people reductions. Yeah. But I do like hearing that some of your cost-saving measures you try to stay away from people and it's your vendor relationships and all that stuff too. That's those are those are tough conversations. I will say too uh I mean I I thought um some of this trickle down wouldn't affect my kids. Uh right, but I even saw in in my my oldest middle school the reduction of teachers there based on budget cuts and how that impacted her uh schedule. So, there's a couple classes that were combined and different things that happened which were all great decisions, but I was like, "Oh gosh, that trickle down is immediate. It's not uh in a few years when, you know, budgets run out and stuff, we'll we'll sun down these programs." It's it's immediate. It's the the impact is felt uh the the very next year from those budget cuts. So, so yeah, I I think both of you guys are doing phenomenal jobs at balancing all of those uh competing forces and just trying to get everything settled. So, certainly very much appreciated what you guys are doing. For sure. So, we we can rein that back in just a little bit uh to talk about our our personal experiences too so we don't get stuck too much on that. Um how do you personally kind of prioritize Dr. A start with you? How do you kind of prioritize when you need new tires? Uh, is there a contingency in your budget that you're like, "These is this is my emergency fund." Or is it just uh, "Oh, shoot. I didn't see that coming. Oh, good. They've got a 0% financing. Let's go with that." Yeah. You know, I think you're always trying to save something for something that's going to happen. Sure. Now, I was thinking on the way here, having children impacts that ability to save for those practical kind of costs that you're going to have to have because kids are expensive. Yeah. And there's always something. They don't get cheaper as they get older, right? No. And I remember when ours were younger, that time is so busy that seems like they're sick a lot. You're at the doctor maybe a lot. Of course, being working parents presents its own challenges, too. So, shout out to all the working moms, dads, aunts, uncles, grandparents. Um, but I think you try to do what you can always to save, right? Save something. And my wondering or encouragement, I'm not for sure the right way to say it, but it would just be even if all you can save is a dollar, $5, you know, 10, 100, whatever it is, it makes a difference, right? Yeah. But it's so hard to do that when you're faced with, we all know the economy is tougher than it's ever been. Costs are higher than they've ever been. So, you know, you just And we hope I hope we've been vested that knowledge in our kids, you know, that it doesn't have to be a large amount. Every little bit can help you when something happens you weren't expecting. Yeah, absolutely. And you've got you're about to have your second in college, correct? Close. Yeah. I've got one at Texas A&M and then which my husband's thrilled about. The Red Raider in me is always very sad to say that. A great school. Um doing a great job with her. But I have a junior at Hebrin. So yeah, two drivers, multiple cars, all all the things. Insurance. Insurance. I'm not looking forward to that. I've got a son, so that's going to hit hard when he's driving. So he does. I have two. Yes. Not one of those real inspiring. No, that's not motivational, is it? That's right. That's not something you look forward to. Your point is really valid, Lori, that when you're h when you have children at home, that is really challenging to um plan for all the possibilities, right? All the things that you need, especially when they start driving because there's going to be repairs that are needed. I can assure you. Yeah. Um maybe a few speeding tickets here or there, some tickets, some um fender benders, some just you you had no idea to plan for that. And I think it's hard because for me, my boys are two years apart and so you get one of them driving and kind of everything underway and then okay, we've settled into this and then here comes the other one. So, it's always being forward thinking um and prepared, but it's hard. It has been much easier for me uh and I think they know it to save now that they're adults, you know, or to to really like I can look at a year in advance and know these are kind of the the trends of the year and this is about what a typical year extra expense and I mean like just taking the dog to the vet or my youngest was in school up at in New Hampshire at Dartmouth for four years and so I knew I could plan next year it's going to cost me about this much to go see him play these games and um but you your life I think maybe stabilizes a little once they're out of the house. Yeah. And you can you know have a little better grip on that. At least it feels that way. Yeah. To me there's a light at the end of the tunnel. At least there is. I thought you know when I get them out of of um child care it's going to be okay. But no, I don't remember what it was, but there is something that just ate that right up. And then Okay. Well, and you're always looking forward to it'll get easier when and in fact, it really probably doesn't. Yeah. You just get smarter along the way and a little wiser and Yeah. Yeah. I had uh uh I did the best thing a Texan could do, which is have their kids in Norman, Oklahoma, Oklahoma. Um but up there um uh preschool prek is part of the school system so it's not an added expense. And so I was paying for my daughter's daycare up until that year and the year that she was ready to go into prek. We moved back to Texas. But I was thinking, "Oh, I just got a raise. I don't have to pay for daycare anymore." And then I came down here and I was like, "Oh, I still have to pay for prek. Dang it." Uh but uh certainly a worthy investment. Glad to do it. But yeah, you just never know from year to year. like you can plan as much as you want, but there's going to be a few things pop up. And I only mentioned speeding tickets, not from personal experience. That that was that was not me. So, um, love you, Mom and Dad. Thank you for keeping me alive all those years. U, so so yeah. Well, um, what are some of the things that you don't mind spending on? How about that? Some some good splurges personally, professionally, however you want to answer that. Personally, uh, it's my kids. Even as expensive as kids are, you know, and and unexpected, I love being able to help them out and take care of them and try to give them a good solid foundation. So, hands down, the thing I'm proudest to spend money on now is my children. Yeah. Even Texas A&M. Oh, yeah. Which is a hard bill to pay. Yeah. Yeah. Well, uh, if you're out there, rap kids, what I just heard is ask for a Camaro. Yeah, exactly. That's what I heard out of that. So, so yeah. How about you? I would say, um, travel and it was with with my kids originally, but the memories um, yeah, so I would say, you know, this podcast is about the psychology of money, the emotion related to money. I think uh raising children is one of the hardest things a relationship navigates and I think money I think they battle for number one and two. What is the hardest thing to navigate as a a family? And um I know we always would have some disagreement around what trip was necessary um because it's expensive to travel. But for me it was always about this is an experience you know and um it wasn't until recently again my boys are young adults. It wasn't until recently that their dad said I know why the trips mattered but it's those are the memories and that's time and you never get that back. Yeah. Um and truly probably if you were to ask my children those are some of their most memorable childhood experiences. So, um I never regretted splurging on a trip and they weren't extra I mean it was it's extravagant I know in some terms but to go to Gulf Shores. It wasn't like we were you know flying overseas or anything really extravagant. It was a road trip to Gulf Shores or um but it costs money to do that. Those things are expensive and that can put a relationship under stress um if you're not on the same page about it. Yeah. But now I don't think either of us regret spending money on those things. Yeah. Yeah. You ask your kids what they got on their 10th birthday and they probably be like, "I don't know." But you be like, "What was our summer vacation when you were 10?" They'll tell you, right? So, and my youngest now, he's the one that was up at Dartmouth and New Hampshire. Um, he didn't have a lot of flexible income while he was up there. He would he played football, so he didn't have a lot of time. Yeah. But during off seasons, he would, you know, work as a a valet or do little odd jobs and save his money because he was in a part of the world he'd never lived in and he wanted to go to Boston, go to Maine, go to Canada. And I just told him, "Spend every dime, yeah, you want to on that because you're going to come back to Texas and you're not going to be able to just get in a car and go do that." Yeah. So, to me, experiences are worth money. Yeah. Um, yeah, it's definitely a good story about how my wife and I balance each other out. But we planned a trip to Chicago once for a weekend just to get away, two of us. And I'm I'm a foodie, so I don't mind spending money on food. I love to cook. Uh, I love really good restaurants, etc. And one of my um favorite cooks, chefs, uh, Grant Ashutz has a a bunch of restaurants in Chicago. So I was like, "Oh, we've got this weekend. His famous, you know, first two or three star restaurant is a Lineia. Uh it's a for kind of just an avantguard kind of forward thinking restaurant. I was like, "We're doing it. We're doing it." And on top of that, I'm going to get a chef's table so we can sit in the kitchen and I can see him work and I can talk to him and wine pairing the whole whole nine yards. This is going to be it, you know, and I don't I don't care what the price tag is. And uh before I booked it because you had to book it six months in advance, my wife was like, "How much?" I was like, "Yeah, you you don't need to know. It's no big deal. You know, we're already going to be there. We should just go ahead and take advant Chicago and have this." She's like, "No, how much?" And so I finally told her and she's like, "Nope, not doing it. Not doing it. I will not enjoy that if I know how much we just spent on that." I'm like, "But it's a it's a threeh hour like eight course like all." She's like, "No, not doing it." I was like, "Fine." So she was probably right. We probably shouldn't have splurged that much. Still had a great time in Chicago. In fact, my favorite meal there was like a hot dog uh at a at a beer garden uh while we're up there. So just shows you. Yeah. Sometimes you can splurge, sometimes you can still have a fun time when you when you don't. That's right. So awesome. Well, don't want to take up too much more of your time, but I do have kind of the no-brainer segment where I ask questions where you don't quite uh uh see coming or it's not on our list at least. Uh just to to respond quickly. I think I really just have one. Well, I guess it's multiple parts. Sorry, it's one question, multiple parts. Um what what got you into teaching? And then what were you thinking when you took the superintendent role? Like was there a transition in thought or was that just a Well, I'm going to stop talking. I'll let you answer that. What got you into teaching? Oh, I got into teaching. I was honestly my older sister, we were both at she's several year years ahead of me in school, but she had had children and come back to school and started studying education and I was actually an accounting major. Um, and it was not filling my bucket being an accounting major. I loved, you know, I talked about my dad teaching me to balance the checkbook and all that. I loved the numbers, the puzzle of that. Um, but accounting was really boring to me and I saw what she was doing getting to work with children and um, so that is what got me into teaching um, and really never looked back from that. And um, I tell people all the time, why did I become superintendent? It's a really great question. I still ask myself that probably most mornings. Um, one of my favorite things to share is I never chose to leave the classroom. Obvious obviously did, but it wasn't a I'm pursuing leaving the classroom. I had a principal that showed up and said in my classroom, you need to enroll in your graduate program to be an administrator. I said, I'm not interested. And he said, well, I'm going to keep coming by your classroom every morning until you're enrolled. And no one wants your principal in their classroom any every morning. And so after several weeks, I finally pursued that. Loved it. Loved being an elementary principal. It's probably my favorite job I ever had. Um but I was getting to the end of that tenure as an elementary principal and someone from um actually it might have been our superintendent encouraged me to pursue a central office job. And I told them at the time standing in my elementary school, I am not going to the dark side. I have absolutely no interest in leaving the campus and going to the dark side and now I'm actually responsible for the entire dark side. So I think you just look up one day and truly and I I try to pay this forward. I think people saw something in me that they wanted me to expand upon and it's just um it was never a pursuit of becoming superintendent. It has always been a if my skills fit this then let me serve in that way and it's good and bad or otherwise now I'm doing that. So she's doing great. Yeah. Oh yeah. Well actually yeah absolutely both of you guys the natural leadership and those abilities they come out and it just naturally kind of cream rises. But I'm just trying to think. So does this make you like Darth Vader? I am afraid so. Yeah. I need the mask and the voice and the whole bit. Yes. More like Obi-Wan uh because you have to you have to give so much to others. Yeah. I love it. I really do love the opportunity now to really influence. One of the the sayings that I know people in my my staff are tired of hearing is however our schools go, so go our communities. Absolutely. And having the ability to influence if our schools thrive, so our communities thrive. Because this is my home. I was raised in Denton. Yeah. Um, so I am I truly feel like it's a privilege now, but I would say it wasn't a an active choice. I didn't go back to pursue my superintendent certificate till I was 50. And Dr. Wilson said, "I think you're going to need it." And I said, "I don't think I am." And I think he was right. Um, but I'm thrilled to do it now and have the opportunity, but it wasn't a something I really was pursuing. Dr. Wilson seems to be right about a lot of things. I know. Darn it. I know. Just kind of Yeah. Great guy. Don't tell him. I won't. He won't listen to this. Yeah. Yeah. Nobody will send it to him either. So that's right. That's We're good. We're good there. What is interesting though, so an accounting background and you're definitely a math background, correct? So I wonder if there's something with the ability to put puzzles together to solve those kind of uh budget or number crunching issues that that naturally brought you guys to the top. How about you, Dr. Rapid? How did you get into teaching? Well, you know, I've shared throughout the whole community after I became superintendent. My third grade teacher really is who inspired me to get into teaching. I knew I wanted to be a teacher from a young age. I was one of those people that looked for every opportunity I could to help others and teach people. So, I knew I was want to be a teacher. I never had it on my radar at all about being a superintendent. Um, so you know, pursued the classroom, got when you're going to teach high school math, you have to get a degree in mathematics. So my bachelor's from Texas Tech is in mathematics. Um, but my third grade teacher made such an impression on me. I've shared, you know, her impact throughout our entire community. I share my story about my real dad that third grade year just leaving my mom and my sister and I. And this the safest place for me was that third grade classroom. I mean, my mom was holding our life together. She's my hero. So thankful for her. Yeah. But truly, school is was a safe a safe place for me to be. And Miss Miss Robertson was there for me during that very traumatic year. And that just lit a fire in me that I wanted to also be able to be there for kids in that way. And math was something I struggled at. So I thought I want to help other people who struggle feel like they can be successful at math and I do absolutely believe you know bachelors in math, masters from TWWU in mathematics. I solve math problems every day for a living in the superintendency. So, so thankful for those experiences, but I kind of had a a watershed moment um in our school district. I've been in our district for going on now 31 years. And uh just had this opportunity to hear about doctoral programs and at the time both the superintendent Dr. Wadell and then Dr. Rogers, who was chief operations officer, said, "You really should consider joining and getting your doctorate." And I and I listened to them and they saw something in me I didn't see in myself either. And I got my doctorate because I looked around the room and I was like, who is going to take care of our public schools? So many people in their careers, you know, were at the latter part of their careers. And I too firmly believe public education is why I'm sitting here today. And I firmly believe public schools are the heartbeat of the local community and we should all be doing everything we can to protect them. So, I was I didn't know what was going to come of the doctorate degree, but got my superintendent certificate as a part of that and was like, we need more people to raise their hand to take care of public schools and I did and love it. Hardest job I've ever had, job I love the most. Yeah. Yeah. One of the thing, one of my favorite Dr. Rap stories I think I've told her is I was in um Dr. Wilson's car with him one day and I think she called or he called her, I can't remember, but he had her on Bluetooth and I wasn't superintendent yet. I was deputy superintendent and um she he I think she just answered and she said, "This job, this is the hardest job I've ever had." And I'm I remember sitting there thinking, "Do I really want to pursue this if he's going to retire?" Like seriously. And she is not wrong. It is a crazy role, but um it is it is good work. I say that all the time. It is hard hard, but it is good work. It is the right work. And and I care about it. You care about it. It's why we do it. Yeah. I think that's definitely what shows the most is how passionate you guys are about the role and about the community. And I 100% agree with you. our communities go as our as our schools go. I mean, that's a big reason why we moved back to to to our part of the woods um after after moving away for a little while and coming back is just the schools. You can't beat them. You know, they're outstanding and they're in great hands. So, I can remember one of the first conversations we had about just about management, about leadership. Uh because you had you have a unique style for your office, right, with the conference table rather than the desk. And so, just getting into that, I was like, "Yeah, we're in good hands." Yeah, if we have people thinking like that, you know, I think we're going to be in good shape for for a long time, both in in Lewisville and Denton. So, absolutely. And I can echo y'all's sentiments as well. I I had a English teacher, Miss Ker at Marcus. Uh Oh, yeah. Louis's great. Yeah. She uh made me, now that I have a PhD in English, I was like, what was she thinking with this assignment? She uh one of the assignments was to interpret uh TS Elliott's love song of Jay Alfred Proufog which people spend entire careers like this is a seminal modernist poem that just is it's crazy. Um and she asked a 17-year-old kid to do it and I did and she gave me a C and I was like like how dare you how dare you give me a C. You can't tell me what I'm not good at. uh and coincidentally I went and got an English degree and then a master's and a PhD in it all because of that experience. But I I think it is something you know she saw something in me that I didn't see. So u pulled it out. So teachers make such a huge difference, superintendent make such a huge difference and we are certainly grateful for you two. We are we are blessed in this area to have you. So thank you. Um with that said, I mean I think that's a great a great way to wrap this thing up, right? Um nothing but compliments. So Well, thanks for having us. Yeah. Thank you. And and thank you to Daku for all the support. We'd be remiss. I mean, if we didn't say Daku believes in community. Absolutely. And it shows. Yeah. And we are so so grateful. Yeah. 100%. When Melanie first approached me, I was like, I don't belong in a credit union. I'm in education. She's like, no. And showed me the relationships Daku has with education. I'm like, oh, that's a company that I want to be involved with. I want to say I um I meet with Melanie pretty regularly just truly to have leadership conversations and which is not your typical peer, right? Someone that's leading a credit union compared to a school district, but those experiences translate. Um, I go into y'all's DC coup branches every once in a while and when they're well I go into them pretty frequently, but when I'm in and I'm having a really good experience, I'll stop and ask them, "Tell me tell me about this. Tell me why you're acting this way or why are you always so friendly or how do you always have all these answers?" And um, inevitably their response comes back to the leadership of your organization, which translates across any organization. And so I just think yeah I mean Daku is a huge partner um for us as a public school system but I think it's those personal connections that are are really important. Absolutely. Absolutely. For the record I did not stage that. That wasn't a question planted. That was spontaneous and I'm I'm grateful for it. So I do also call Melanie when I get that good feedback. I say so I'm your spy. I was your mole today and this is what's working. This is what they appreciate. Yeah. Nice. Uh, well, and I do I mean just I think to that point to give shoutouts, I can't say thank you enough to the energy that Mary Jacobe brings. Yeah. To our schools and that's obviously evident from the leadership of Daku too, but culture. Yeah. I mean, you just know y'all are cheerleaders for teachers and kids and classrooms and it shows. Yeah. And it's great. Yeah. I'll let Mary know. Yeah. She is a fountain of energy for sure. She just keeps going. Yeah, she's got a lot of it. So, well, awesome. Well, thank you guys so much. We really appreciate you guys being here. Thank you for the conversation. Uh hope we all learned something today. U not just about them, but about public finance as well. Certainly encourage you to go do more research and uh find out what you can. But thanks guys for being with us and we'll catch you on the next episode.